What I would like to see is a complementary article – “Is lack of sex equal to emotional or mental marital abuse?”

Obviously lack of sex is not equal to physical abuse. That is another story, and can’t be compared.

But I have read about many divorce cases and even criminal cases involving mental and emotional abuse, and that can damage a person emotionally, mentally, and even to a point of affecting their physical health.

So, can denying sex be equivalent to that?

I thought long and hard about what to say to you both. I just have no words. I wish I could sit with you and just hold your hand.

Prayers and healing,

J

Anonymous left another reply. In fairness, I want to report the following from it: “BW, I’m sorry for your history and wish you the best. I do still stick to my guns…God bless.” There is more. I contemplated for some time whether to print the whole message. There’s no personal attack in his response, and of course he can espouse whatever position he wishes. However, I vehemently disagree with his stance, and in this case, I’m more concerned with those who have personally been victims.

Anonymous–If you want to talk about this further, maybe you can post something to your own blog. I am discontinuing this discussion about rape vs. refusal. That was never the point of this post, and I am utterly heartbroken by the stories of Teresa and Butterfly Wings–also knowing that there are other women out there who have experienced such violation.

Anyone who reads my blog knows how much I advocate frequent sexual intimacy within marriage. But the focus of this post is for spouses who have been brutalized by rape in marriage to know that it’s not okay with God and they should seek help and healing.

Blessings to all!

Spot on!

You say it is easier to recover from rape than refusal? rubbish. Speak to any man who has been raped by someone and who has been regularly refused by his wife, and I guarantee which he’ll say is worse. In years of looking into the issue, having come across tens of thousands of spousal rape, I have only once come across a case of a female raping their husband. I guarantee if you were in the situation where your wife could rape, where you flat out refused to have sex with her and strongly did not want to have sex with her, you’d finally understand why no man would choose spousal rape over refusal. Even in the case I have come across (and trust me, I’ve searched hard to find others), I guarantee the man would not have chosen the rape over refusal. The physical shock of being violated by his wives (yes wives, plural) killed him.

Yes persistent refusal (and I mean repeated persistant, not the occasional one off thing) is abusive, but it is NOT brutal at all. “Brutal” in terms of rape is a physical thing. Even in terms of emotional abuse, refusal is not brutal. “Brutal” would be the refuser telling their spouse they are ugly, limp and suck in bed. That is emotionally brutal – not the simple act of refusal. Yes it is painful – even incredibly painful – try being a female being refused! It damages a woman to deal with a refusing husband because you are raised by society to believe that all men want sex all the time and if your husband never wants sex, imagine what that does to your mind – you not only feel unloved by your husband, but you feel unlovable – if your own husband doesn’t want to have sex and “all men want sex all the time), it’s devastating in a way that even most men who have been refused cannot undersand. Refused men know that they could sex, that other women would want them, that the problem is their wife is messed up – refused women don’t have that. they feel like no man could ever want them, that they are detestful and I have known women who have been driven suicide. And honestly, I reached the point at one stage where I seriously considered it because I felt so unwanted, especially after my first husband’s persistent cheating despite the fact we were having sex at least once a day and I was ready, willing and able 24/7 and the only time in our 8 year marriage I ever said no was after my major surgery and he raped me for it.

Men who are refused know the problem is with their wife, women who are refused usually believe the fault lies with them as they must be pathetic to be able to make a man not want sex.

I realise you honestly believe what you are saying, but it is out of touch with the truth of the situation.

I guarantee you have never spoken to a person who has both been a victim of both chronic refusal and of spousal rape – they are rare. I doubt you even know anyone who has been a victim of both chronic refusal and any sort of rape. Until you have spoken to someone who has been through both you cannot understand. to be honest, until you have been through both, you cannot truly understand.

“Rape=taking something from someone sexually they had no right to take
Refusal=the same
Rape & Refusal both are abusive, brutal and disregard the other human being (in your words).”

I’m sorry Anonymous, I know you mean well and honestly believe what you are saying but you have no clue. Honestly no clue.

There is a massive difference between physically violently forcing your way into someone’s body, and simply denying someone sex.

There are completely valid reasons for refusal – you even mention them yourself such as surgery and recent childbirth. My (now ex) husband raped me the day after I had major surgery. The surgeon had made it clear to refrain from sex and I was in absolute agony. In fact I wasn’t even supposed to be home, having discharged myself two days early (staying one night instead of recommended minimum three) because I couldn’t sleep in a noisy hospital and desperately needed some rest. He violently forced himself out on me, refusing to take no or even just to wait a few hours. Even when I begged him to stop just long enough condoms he wouldn’t.

Sticking any p**** in any v***** when a woman says no is rape. Doesn’t matter if she is a wife, a friend or a total stranger. It is a violent violation.

It is NOTHING compared to being refused. And I have a right to say that. My second husband is a refuser and I have a very high sex drive. It drives me to distraction when he constantly says no. On our 15 day honeymoon, we had sex a grand total of three times in the first five days, and then nothing at all for 10 days. We got home, and then he was due to head off the next to go away for work for over a month and he repeatedly refused me those two days, even knowing full well we had had no sex for 10 days and were about to go another 40 with none.

For someone with a high sex drive like me (I want to do it at least once a day and on my first honeymoon, we had sex 4-6 times a day, no less), this was horrible. But it is NOTHING compared to rape. Not even remotely close.

…. to be continued (ran out of word count)

Hi Jay Dee, I really like how you describe the situation. I wonder if it’s splitting hairs but I do like it.

I was in the situation with my first husband, a day after having major surgery, after having discharged myself two days early, I said to my husband I couldn’t do it, because I was in agony (and medically wasn’t allowed to be having sex) and my husband simply decided if I wasn’t able to, he’d force me to. We weren’t able to use our normal form of contraception at the time because of my surgery, so after trying to tell him I couldn’t do it, when he began forcing it, I begged him to at least go to the shop and get condoms. Mainly to diffuse the situation, hoping it would be a distraction for him to drop it, but at least if he did force me, we’d be protected from having children he wasn’t mentally capable of dealing with.

And that’s how my daughter was conceived. I adore her – and I cannot stand people who use rape as an excuse to dispose of their babies, their own flesh and blood. How she was conceived doesn’t change that she is my child and adored. But my exhusband couldn’t cope with her, and just after she was born he went from mentally ill to having a total psychotic break and things never got better from there.

But that is the only time in our marriage I ever said no – even after I was sexually assaulted by a stranger two years later, I didn’t say no then because I figured if I was physically capable, then I wouldn’t say no. Unfortunately that wasn’t even enough for my now-ex husband. I’d occasionally jump when he did something specific my attacker did even though I explained to him that’s what my attacker did and he’d totally lose it and verbally and even sometimes physically abuse me because I “didn’t really love him” because I couldn’t make myself enjoy that one particular thing. Before it happened, it wasn’t even something he was much interested in, but after it happened, he did it over and over to make a point, that I had to enjoy anything and everything he did if I “truly loved” him.

In many ways, that was worse than him raping me or the sexual assault from a stranger combined.

A marriage is meant to be the pinnacle of human relationship closeness which is why it is so destructive when rape rears it’s ugly head. No matter who does, it is a terrible evil, but when it’s someone you know, it’s harder to deal with, and the closer that someone is, the more incredibly painful it is. The only thing I consider worse is paedophilia or incest.

It is not a violation of your body, but it is a violation of your inner person. And sadly something that many people don’t take seriously. I know all too many churches and authorities (like the police and courts) who deny that spousal rape is even possible and that is just really sad. Most victims don’t even speak up (spousal rape is far more under reported than general rape, and even that is drastically under reported) and those do finally speak up, have to deal with being mocked by authorites, and often being told by their churches, that their body belongs to their spouse and therefore there is no such thing as spousal rape.

I know the church is full of humans, and humans are “only human” and while I know that fellowship is very important, I sometimes wonder if churches do more harm than good most of the time.

Paul I can’t agree that a person who has refused has always failed to fulfil their responsibility. When someone is seriously ill or injured for example, there is no failure or sin on their part because they are genuinely unable to.

I guess it’s like comparing the situation to if someone who is hungry approaches us and asks for food and we are so poor ourselves that we have no food and are wondering how we are going to feed our kids that day, we have done nothing wrong in “refusing” to give food to someone who is hungry.

A person cannot give what they don’t have.

But I do like what you said otherwise.

J, while I agree we maintain our free will, we promised to act in a certain way more or less promising or guaruanteeing our free will goes to our spouse on every decision. Will we all fall short of that? Without a doubt. I know I sure have but I don’t get up everyday and decide whether to exercise my free will that day. I’ve already promised it. I hope that makes sense. I’m going to sign off now but thank you both & God bless you-

I’ve thought about your first response all day yesterday and then again this morning. I desperately wanted to tell you how much it bothered me. But I wanted to tell you in a healthy way that explained why. And then when I came back and looked at your follow up responses I realized that I just can’t explain it in a way that could ever make you understand. I was date raped at 16. That was how I lost my virginity. I am now 42 and despite 26 years of active healing on my part, I still struggle with the echoes of that violent act. I can tell you that if my husband was to hold me down, force his body into mine, and the entire time ignore the fact that I was struggling, crying and begging him to stop, not only would I consider that rape, I would consider it a much more vile act than the actions of that evil 16 year old boy. And not only would he be tainted by the sin of his act, he would be prosecuted to the full extent of the law for his criminal act. I pray that all people exist in healthy, happy, loving marriages where rape could never happen. But it does. And, in my opinion, operates completely outside of the commitment I make to my spouse. I wish to take nothing away from the struggle of those people who feel like they have been unloved and neglected by their spouses. I don’t know their pain and I do not wish to chime in in ignorance. But I do suspect that that is indeed an apples to oranges discussion.

Teresa